The UpTic

Holistic Approaches to Comprehensive Care with Clinical Psychologists

• New Jersey Center for Tourette Syndrome and Associated Disorders • Season 2 • Episode 25

Share episode

In this episode, I sit down with Dr. Lori Rockmore and Dr. Daniela Colognori, two clinical psychologists with extensive experience treating individuals with Tourette syndrome (TS) and related conditions. Both have a rich history of working at the Rutgers TS Clinic, where they gained invaluable insights into providing holistic, family-focused care. Throughout our conversation, we discuss their personal journeys into the field, how their practice has evolved, and the incredible strengths they see in their patients.

We discuss what it means to offer holistic treatment, going beyond the tics themselves to address broader issues like school performance, family dynamics, and other comorbid conditions such as OCD and anxiety. Dr. Rockmore and Dr. Colognori share stories of resilience, the importance of seeing the whole person, and how families play a crucial role in supporting individuals with TS. 

 

Episode Highlights:
[01:17] – Dr. Rockmore shares how her work in Tourette began, sparked by her collaboration with Dr. Kathy Budman.
[03:57] – Dr. Colognori recounts how she was "randomly" placed in the Rutgers TS program and ended up working alongside Dr. Rockmore.
[06:49] – Holistic care explained: Addressing the patient as a whole, including family, school challenges, and comorbidities like OCD and anxiety.
[09:34] – Dr. Rockmore and Dr. Colognori discuss the strengths of children with TS, emphasizing their talents beyond their tics.
[12:45] – Exploring the challenges and rewards of training students to treat TS, and how the Rutgers program equips them for treating complex conditions.
[20:17] – Practical advice: Dr. Rockmore and Dr. Colognori outline how they prioritize interventions based on functional impairments and patient input.
[24:20] – Advice to patients with Tourette’s: "Tics are just one part of who you are—pursue your passions and live your life to the fullest."

 

Links & Resources:

Remember, each story shared on this podcast brings light and understanding to the diverse experiences within the Tourette's community. Your journey is your own, and it's filled with potential and promise. If this episode resonated with you, I encourage you to like, share, and leave a review to help us connect with more listeners.

Send us a Text Message.

Support the Show.

Send us a text

Support the show

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

Actors, ballerinas, football players, soccer Yeah. Soccer players, yes. I mean, I've had a valedictorian come through my doors. So that's the thing is that these kids are amazing and have so many strengths, and it's just a matter of supporting them and getting through the hard years right before the puberty and adolescence, and getting through that time period and keeping those strengths being advocates

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

for them to get to the other side of that.

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

You've seen this happen so many times, encouraging the parents and letting them know it gonna

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

be all right.

Michael Leopold:

Welcome to the uptick brought to you by The New Jersey Center for Tourette syndrome and associated disorders, empowering children and adults through education, advocacy and research, by sharing the stories and experiences relevant to the TS community. Welcome back to the uptick today, I'm joined with doctors Lori brockmore and Daniela kagliori, two clinical psychologists at specialized psychological services in Short Hills New Jersey. They both previously work at the njcts rutgers TS clinic. It's great to have both of you on the uptick. Thanks

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

for having us.

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

Thank you.

Michael Leopold:

I'd love to learn a little bit about how you both got into Tourette's work.

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

For me, it started before, I guess, I graduated from graduate school. I was working at North Shore Hospital in Long Island. I was looking to do some research, and I got hooked up with Dr Kathy Budman, who was an internationally known expert in Tourette, getting to work with her and experience the patients that she was seeing, going to conferences and learning about her research. It sort of got me hooked a little bit, and I decided to do my dissertation with her, and part of that dissertation was going and interviewing 120 children and families who had Tourette's. So I got in my car and I drove around throughout the tri state area, and after hearing those family stories, I was kind of hooked into the Tourette world. After that, I got roped into running the TS program at Rutgers, and that's history, I guess. Love

Michael Leopold:

that. And then that was Dr Lori Rockmore for our listeners. And now we'll hear

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

hear from you. Yes, I was a did my graduate work at Kazakh at Rutgers, and so when you were at the time, I'm sure maybe it's different all these years later, but at the time, they randomly placed you into your first field work type externship in the clinic or internship, into your first sort of clinical rotation at Kazakh your very first year. So I was randomly placed into the TS program as incoming student. And that was really fortuitous or interesting to me, because I actually have a experience with a family member who has had tix and OCD in the past. So I was really excited about it. But when I arrived in 2004 as a student, it was a really, really small, like beginnings of babies of a program, and that was really right before NGC TS got involved. And so I went through my first year, and we had some very small programming, mostly focused on family members, supporting family members of kids with Ts. When we were deciding about the second year, people suggested like that, maybe I should stay on. I had expressed interest in that because they were trying to grow the program. And that's when I met Lori, actually. So she in 2005 right during my second year of like, hey, we hired someone who has a lot of experience in this area, and we're trying to grow this program. And so Lori and I work together, her as like, expert content knowledge, and me as like, oh, I kind of know what's going on here at Gaza at this clinic. That's how we met, started working together and tried to grow the program there.

Michael Leopold:

Both of you still involved in Tourette's work as well, and are at a clinic now in Short Hills, taste, the tread, population, the your focus, kind of specialty. Now,

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

Lori and I sort of would joke back in the day that, like maybe one day we should go into practice together. And many, many years later that this has happened. So we are partners in that practice, along with one other Dr, Rob hapik, who also had done some to yes work. So the three of us come from that foundation. And so while our practice is general, we serve clients with all sorts of comorbid things, and we all have slightly different backgrounds in other sort of specialty areas. But one thing that unites us is that we're all trained in working with families with Ts, and that is, I would say, still a very large percentage of our practice, but not our only specialty area.

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

What we kind of have that like sort of differentiates us is that, I think we understand families and individuals with ts a little bit. More in depth than somebody who didn't come through the Tourette clinic. We have years and years of experience. We have hundreds of patients under our belt that we have seen who have ticks. We also understand the comorbidities and the bigger picture of life with ticks, just because we've seen so many individuals and families, when people come to us with Tourette's, it's just very familiar to us. Those patients walk in our door and we're just like, oh, we get you. And I think the patients feel the same way that they feel understood some doctors, they may see like 510, individuals with Tourette, and we could say we've definitely seen over hundreds. I think that's a big, a big difference for us?

Unknown:

Incredible. Yeah, you're gonna add something. I

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

was just gonna say. I also think so. Lori and I have both served as directors of the clinic at Rutgers, obviously her for a long time, and she was my supervisor and mentor for a long time, and then I took on that role. And we often joke that we like try to keep an eye on making sure that that clinic is continued to be running the way in which the initial vision from faith. A lot of the people at Rutgers that helped to get that going started with and I think one thing that we really have always focused on is like we are not running a CBIT clinic or practice. We all do CBIT, we teach CBI. We're big proponents for CBIT, but really try to be more holistic in terms of how we can serve and help and support individuals and their families. And I think that that is also one thing that both differentiates our current services as our practice and what we have tried to really leave as our mark on the clinic at Rutgers and the current leadership there. No,

Michael Leopold:

I hear that. And providing holistic care is so important. We've definitely had CBIT professionals on the uptick before speaking and educating listeners on how that works. What it is I'd love to hear a little bit more about what that holistic care looks like in your case. And I've noticed how you kept saying families, as opposed to just TS patients or clients, because it is about all of the family having tics also affects my siblings and things like that. Would love to hear a little bit more about that comprehensive holistic care that you provide, and maybe some tangible examples of what that looks like in a session,

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

when we do our initial evaluation, we're always looking to see what is impairing the child in their environment. First, like we look to see what is the most pressing issue that they're coming into us with, and very often, it's not the ticks, it's more about functioning in school, and how they're the accommodations that they might need in school, or how can they better be serviced by the school district and the individual teachers, the families in the home, sometimes the OCD or could be a big problem with inside the family for the other for the siblings or for the parents, behavior management, sometimes working on ways to help the family sort of cope and manage behaviors that are impacting them, getting out of the house in the morning, or sort of Getting through dinner at night, or activities, the activities that the the individuals participating outside of school. So we really try to advocate for them. And also make referrals, make referrals to the ngcts and make referrals to Leadership Academy and the camps that the njcts runs, just to help them find other kids that may understand them and they feel that they're not so different. So we try to look more holistically and help the individual and the family meet the goals that they come into us with.

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

We're both moms, and I feel like, and actually it's interesting for me, because I started this before I had kids, and it's like, when you're telling parents, oh, like, you have to ignore the tics, it's like, really interesting coming at that from both sides of not having kids. And it's kind of like, oh, like, I like the emotionality of watching your kid really struggle, or being physical pain or emotional pain from the tics, and I feel like parents need, like, a lot of support and coaching in how do I find ways to ignore that? Or how do I find ways to make sure that I am attending to the other sibling or siblings while going through this really crisis time, if it's when a kid is first diagnosed, or just having, like, a lot of bouts of ticks or behavioral issues that go along with that. So really just trying to, like, understand the situation from a family perspective, and really trying to support families

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

as well. Yeah, and also, these kids have so many special talents, and I think sometimes that gets overlooked by the ticks, just the athletic and intellectual. I mean, I've had kids that go on to Ivy League schools who go on the play professional town musical talents, exactly, yeah. Number of drummers that have been I mean, it's

Michael Leopold:

play drums. Yeah. I press reflexes and like, just, there's a musical giftedness to it. I found for me always, I don't know if you're either be musicians, but like, sightseeing music, just putting music up in front of me and saying, Okay, go start playing. I've never reversed it. I've never read the music. Just give me the sheet music and I play it. I could, growing up, do that with very minimal errors. And I always felt like there was something to retic about that, that there was, there was something in my Tourette's neuroatypical brain that allowed me to just process music like that, my wrist reflexes or something. Yes, music,

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

I think, actors, ballerinas, football players, soccer, soccer. Yeah. Soccer players, yes. I mean, I've had a valedictorian come through my doors. So that's the thing is that these kids are amazing and have so many strengths, and it's just a matter of supporting them and getting through the hard years right before, like puberty and adolescence, and getting through that time period and keeping those strengths

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

being advocates for them to get to the other side of that.

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

You've seen this happen so many times, encouraging the parents and letting them know it's gonna be all right. All right, exactly. It's just, this is a hard time, but getting through adolescence, getting through puberty, getting to junior year of high school, let's just hang in there. I'm pretty sure it's gonna be okay.

Michael Leopold:

Yeah, no. Parents always best for their kids. It's always harder for the parents in the sense seeing their kid tick and wanting to do more, wanting to help them. And when I was diagnosed, honestly, I didn't think much of it. It was kind of all right, something I have and do that was just my experience, but I think it impacted my parents more than than than me. I was, heck, I was glad to have an answer for why I kept twitching my head up and down, and why no one else was doing that in my class. But I still felt like me, do you both treat adult what you're in as well, or is your focus more on children and families? Well,

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

I mean, we see adults, not as many, a lot of adults. They've come to accept their tics. They kind of have fallen into a good groove with them. Occasionally, I think I find more Tourette patients, adult patients come to us for the comorbidities. I am for me, I don't know about you, but a lot of people come in for the OCD, trichotillos, trichotillomania. That's really what I see most Tourette adults with. It's interesting, because then some of them have children who start displaying some ticks. I've worked with a lot of adult patients that have had Tourette and then go on to have kids that have some symptoms. So then I've worked on supporting them with that process. I'd say most of our practices children, adolescents with Yeah, I would

Michael Leopold:

love to hear a little bit of your thoughts on this broader topic of where we're at right now, the state of it. Where do we go from here? What you see as next steps to improve that,

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

what we're doing at the at Rutgers in the graduate program is extremely important. I will say that I am very, very proud of the students that I have trained, because they have really embraced the Tourette population, and they have really understood why it's so valuable to have this knowledge to treat individuals with TF. I've always said that if you can treat a TF patient, you can treat any other patient, because there's so many. You learn so much about clinical psychology when working with individuals with TF, because the comorbidities are bad. If you can treat a complex patient, you can definitely treat a more simplistic one diagnosis situation, basically, individuals with Ts are extremely complex, especially the patients that come into the clinic at Rutgers. The patients that come into Rutgers are very complex in nature. I've always told my students that if you can treat the complexities of TF, you can treat patients who have one disorder or another. I really focused on training them on how to identify TF, how to identify OCD, how to identify ADHD, how to identify as generalized anxiety disorder, panic disorder. We go through all the individual diagnoses and learn how to identify them, and then what the most efficacious treatments are for them. And then when we you know, when you learn about all that, and then you actually get to experience it in the clinic with patients. They understand it, when you break it down in that kind of way, when you help them know how to diagnose and then how to what the most efficacious treatments are, I feel like they get it, and then they get hooked. And since yet, most of my students that have gone through the program have stuck with it. I will say, I pick up the phone and I call, you know, if I can't, if I can take a patient, I say, Oh, but I have Graham or I have Michelle, or I have Mayor, or I have Jeremy, or I have Sean out in Oregon, or wherever he is, and I could just pick up that phone and call, and I know that we all understand these patients, and I feel comfortable referring them to anybody that has gone through the TS program at Rutgers. So I think there is a shortage, but I do think. What we created is so important. It's something that I think should be replicated in other graduate programs. I think it would be a huge benefit to the TF population. There's a lot of value in just what you learn going through a program like that.

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

I think part of that, too, is learning how to see the big picture, right? Because of the comorbid picture, a lot of times, it's really teaches you to try to understand, what are the most pressing priorities, or what will be the biggest bang for your buck in terms of of intervention, what are we trying to target or like, if we can solve this daily problem that's happening, right? Like, how much pressure that will take off other things, right and have a trickle down effect. So I think it's a, it's really like a problem solving exercise, too, in terms of figuring out where to prioritize your efforts, which I think was a really helpful tool, and I think is something that also generalizes just as a general good skill as a clinician to all individuals that you're working with. So I think that that was an important piece of it, too, in my time at Rutgers, as as director of the TS clinic, I think that people are like, wow, they have a whole clinic for Tourette's right? Because I think, like in the general world's population. It's not people don't understand that it's common, or don't understand that lots of people can have tics without having really visible Ts in the way that it's portrayed in the media and things like that. And a lot of times, students are kind of, like, a little skeptical, maybe about like, Oh, it's a whole clinic just for Ts. And so I would always sell it as, like, kind of what Lori said, I use those lines a lot, like, oh, but you'll learn, if you are interested in working with children and adolescents, like, this rotation is for you, because you'll, you'll see every kind of disorder as a comorbidity throughout your year here. And that was my way of like, getting them in the door. And then, like Lori said, I think, like most people, just really loved it because they get a lot of experience, and these families are often this is speaking to part of the problem, but have been looking for years, or have been spinning their wheels, trying to find a clinic or clinicians that were going to really be able to Be knowledgeable enough and skilled enough to be able to treat them again like as a family system, and not just a c bit here or a little thing here. They're so grateful a lot of times for the services that they receive because they've spent so long trying to find appropriate care, and they're traveling from all over New Jersey to come there students who are trainees in the clinic grow to really like, love it, and then now they have a specialty that not a lot of people have, and so they continue to exercise that and and we've created this sort of really informal network of our previous students in various places. It's grown in that way. Yeah, and I think the students,

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

some of them go on to specialize in Ts, but some of them go on to specialize in OCD or int or in eating disorders. But still, the foundations of what they learned in the TS program are continuing to be valuable, because I get these phone calls and I get emails, especially around the holidays, from old students, who are just thanking me for the training and the experience, because they just feel like they have knowledge that is helpful for them in their careers.

Michael Leopold:

It really is incredible. I mean, I would say we need these at all the states partnering with more universities, just like you said, to have these practicums and clinics that are devoted to Tourette and CO occurring conditions to really dive into that. What's it like to be a practitioner of that space, being on the ground, doing that work and giving that training about how many people were in a cohort or a class at for the Rutgers program,

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

four to five? Yeah. Okay, so

Michael Leopold:

you get to know them pretty well. I imagine, like, well, then some

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

of them do stay on for a second year. So we would have three or four first years, and then they would have the option stand for a second year, right? Sometimes,

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

I think that stayed on. I mean, I just stayed forever. I think that's less rare now, because it's like they have to get different experience. But often there's also one postdoc who is there for more hours, and obviously it is more experienced because they so they have graduated, but are still trying to get their hours towards licensure. That has been a helpful training experience as well. It's

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

still building on No, no. Really the question, one of

Michael Leopold:

the things I love hearing here is you both mentioned the need to prioritize when working with with patients, and really understand what is it that are the biggest challenges they're going through now and focus on that. I think sometimes we rush to help in the areas that weren't able to help and we may forget or overlook, okay, what do they actually need? What's going to move the needle the most in their life right now? How can I bring them the most value? And I'd love to share a little more about how you do that. I mean, I know this is a this is what your your expert. In and probably hard to just put in a concise little, little pithy podcast statement or two, but we'd love to hear a little bit about what goes through your mind when you're talking to a patient trying to understand, how best can I support them in school or wherever they are right now in life, for me,

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

it's identifying functional impairment, what is causing them so if they are struggling in school, what is it? Is it their attentional issues? Is it their tics? Is it their OCD? We have all these different instruments we use. We do clinical evals interviews, but we also do a lot of paper and pencil kind of interviews to really assess where there's the most impairment, and then also getting information from the parents, from the teachers, from the individual themselves, like identifying what do they think is causing them this problem? We see families that some families do come in strictly foresee that parents will say that the neurologist sent them for this, or their pediatrician sent them because they heard about CBD, and then the individual, the kid, comes in, or the individual comes in and it's not really bothering them. That's not what's causing them, the functional impairment the parents are bothered by it. The parents have a hard time sitting through dinner or but again, is that something that we should work on? And I most of the times it comes out that we don't usually use cbet for those kind of cases. If the kid themselves are not motivated or don't see that as being the big a big problem, then we really work very hard on trying to talk to the parents and look at other areas that we can work on that would make people more comfortable in the house or in the school. I do a lot of writing letters to the school district, going in and speaking with the teachers, with the you know, administration, on how best they can learn to work with this individual who has ticks so that the individual is learning to the best of their ability, and the other students are not impacted, and the teacher can teach to the best of their ability. So we really do try to work all together like that, but yeah, it's really identifying, getting the individual input about what's impairing for them, speaking to the family, and also speaking with the child teacher, or occasionally, I've talked to coaches, I've talked to religious leaders. I've talked to just whoever, wherever this child is, what environments they're functioning in, and I would say

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

also like understanding each individual's, like the nature of their individual Ts. There's so many examples where, like, a kid might have a lot of anxiety. And like, for some people, anxiety kicks up the tics really intensely. For some people, that's not really a trigger for their tics. And so sometimes it's trying to understand, hey, like, if I can treat the anxiety, not only will that maybe make a bigger impact overall in terms of their level of comfort at school or whatever the situations is, it also has the added benefit of it's probably going to decrease their tics some, because they'll feel more in control of their anxiety and feel calmer, right? Or like, I have certain kids where their tics are so impacted by sleep, everyone is to some degree. But I have a couple where it's just like, I'll see them and I'll be like, how much sleep, like Echo, maybe we really need to prioritize what's going on at bedtime. Or how can we look at, like, your overall schedule to make sure that you get enough sleep so that, like, you have less tics that get in the way, because that's something that you know, so that when I say kind of like, bang for the buck, it's sort of like trying to understand their overall picture of symptoms and seeing that like, oh, well, maybe actually, we could make the biggest impact in terms of your overall life and also your frequency or intensity of ticks by targeting this other area over here that's going to have this trickle down effect. So I think that that's a big part of prioritizing as well. Yeah, I would agree. Yeah. I

Michael Leopold:

love getting to know the kind of the 360 view, what do the parents say, the coaches, teachers, family, but then also, what's, what's going to motivate the kid? Like you said, Laurie CBIT, works best when you are committed to it. And I can say it's tough work to commit to that and be focused on it, and practice the competing responses and all that. So if your heart's not into it, and that's not what's you see as the challenge that would why focus on that? One thing I like to ask all of our guests on the episodes here is what advice you'd give to a to a direct patient would love to have both of you answer that?

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

Well, that's a very broad question. I think what I say to kids that come in is that the tics are only one very small part of who you are, and you are a whole person. And just like I have green eyes or I have light brown hair or whatever color I have these days, I'm not sure about it, it's just one small part of us and you are pursuing your passions and doing what you love. You know, if the tics are bothering you, we'll figure out ways. Just like I could change the color of my hair, you can work on your tic. There are things that we can do to help you feel better, and it's such a small part that we don't really need to pay so much attention to it. Sometimes, just live your life. You know, be you. Yeah. Mean, I

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

similarly, I mean, I always try to say, like everyone has their challenges in the cards that they're dealt. And like ticks sometimes are particularly challenging because they are out there, invisible to the world. And when you feel like you're out of control, that's a scary feeling, but similar to what Lori said, that's just one part of who you are, that's your challenge to overcome, how to still be yourself and be genuine to yourself and pursue what's important to you with this, in spite of this and leaning into this. And I always, I often tell parents, this wasn't exactly the question but, but I often tell parents that like what I see over the years is sort of like a kid and a family's attitudes towards their tics is more important to the overall prognosis of how a kid is going to do in the long run compared to the actual intensity or severity of their tics. Meaning, like, I sometimes see kids with really out there visible intensive veer tics or just like, bashes me, right? And like, it doesn't stop them. It doesn't deter them. The parents are really able to get behind that and not worry so much. And like, they come out of it the other side, just themselves with ticks, versus some other kids where it's like, and families where maybe their tics are not really, actually that visible or severe or intense, but they've just, for whatever reason, had such a hard time accepting it and being able to put it into perspective and the attention on it and the distress about it can really, like stop them from doing the things that they really want to do because of how they feel about tics. And so I remind parents that a lot is in their control in terms of how the families integrates and accepts and finds a way to put it in a place

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

I think they can do whatever they want to do. A lot of kids come into me and they just are afraid that this is going to stop them and their dreams and their ambitions. And I will tell you, from all of my experience that I have seen kids and individuals with ticks do the most amazing things, going to Ivy League schools, playing like I said, division one sports, going to law school, becoming doctors, becoming researchers, neuroscientists. I've actually seen one of those, and that person will probably know who they are. I've just seen people do such amazing things, and there's no stopping you, really.

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

It's funny. One tangible example is like, I can't tell you how many kids and parents come and be like, I'm never gonna be able to drive a car. And I'm just like, Yeah, you are when I drive a car, right? Like, and I can't, like, how many secret sessions I've had from them in the car. Like, I'm in zoom, they're in the car. And I'm like, Okay, show me how this tick looks in your car. You know, we're gonna find a way around it. Like, you can drive. Most of

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

my patients with ticks, actually, when they drive, they tell me that they don't have Yes, yes, that they're not

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

available. They don't believe that. And so you have to get to that point, and then the exposure, yeah, I still have a couple. I'm like, but look, you can just wait till the red light, or you can push against this part of the car. That's a really tangible example. I feel like, of like, What do you mean? Of course, you can any

Michael Leopold:

other topics or points you either, if you want to bring up the floor, is yours.

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

I mean, I think just we're so both to speak for both of us, like so grateful for faith and Rutgers and everyone that was involved in getting that clinic up and running and where it is today. It's been a really great opportunity for both of us to be in this world that not really that intentional on either of our parts, but don't know professionally or personally where we'd be without that. Actually, it's

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

been a quite an amazing journey like getting here. We couldn't have done it without the support of the njctf and faith Rice, who really talking to

Dr. Daniela Colognori:

us, yeah, and all of the students you know that get out of it are really teach her and her efforts and her persistence, and she was the main thing, yeah, she

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

was a pretty amazing woman. Really

Unknown:

incredible. Yeah, she

Michael Leopold:

was and building all of this up. Well, thank both of you for being on the podcast episode here, I would love to speak with you again, and I wish both of you success in your professional endeavors. Hope you have a wonderful rest of your day

Dr. Lori Rockmore:

here. Thank you. Thank you having us

Unknown:

welcome and thank all of you for joining us on the uptick.

Michael Leopold:

Thank you for listening to the uptick, brought to you by The New Jersey Center for Tourette syndrome and associated disorders, empowering you to stretch the boundaries to live your best life. The NJ center for Tourette syndrome and associated disorders, njcts, its directors and employees assume no responsibility for the accuracy, completeness, objectivity, or usefulness of the information presented on this podcast. We do not endorse any recommendation or opinion made by any guest, nor do we advocate any treatment you.

People on this episode

Head Shot

Michael Leopold

Host